The Scam Called Kid Recital Videos

Posted on 07 23, 2007 under Doodads by Noodad | Comments


[editor's note] This article spawned a follow-up article on choosing a dance studio after a fierce-turned-friendly-flame war in the comments.  

all_on_stage_pose

Videotaping your kid's soccer game or ballet performance no longer means carrying a typewriter-sized box on your shoulder. Gone are the days where every school holiday concert is filed with dads in the aisles trying to catch the best angle for their Spielbergian masterpiece. But the absence of these situations is not because of the smaller video cameras out in the market. No, it is because companies are hiding behind their "value-add" and "professional quality" facades and gang raping parents in the auditorium.

So this is one of those critical junctions in the article where I have lost you or you already know where I'm going with this. Here's the deal.

My 4 year old daughter takes ballet lessons. Cool right? And she totally gets into it. She's got the shoes, the leotards, the tights, the whole nine yards. So at the end of the year we get to go watch her perform with her class. This mind you, is a performance where every class from every age group in the entire dance studio performs. 

Now I can on and on on how you have to not only pay for the classes but you need to pay for the costume, the fancy sweatshirt with the embroidered name on the sleeve, the professional pictures with her in costume, and even the tickets to the show but that may make you think this is all a scam. I don't mind paying for the costume…or the tickets for that matter (although it is sort of a rip off because they know people aren't going to miss the performance no matter how much they charge).

{mosnooad}That is all reasonable. What isn't reasonable is the following situation. You are not allowed to take pictures or video during the performance. Why? Well, because the dance academy decided to hire a professional video production company and by forbidding personal cameras you had to purchase the professional one.Sucks right? Well, here is where we get to the gang raping part. My daughter was awesome! I'm sure every parent thought the same for their kid. I couldn't take my eyes off of her for the entire performance. Which is a good thing because my memories is all I will ever have. You see, after spending $30 (yes, $30) and waiting 4 weeks for delivery, the video I got barely showed my daughter. Her class was pretty big and the dance line stretched across the stage. So the entire performance had the camera panning back and forth. I basically saw my daughter 4 times in a 3 minute period.
Here's what gets me pissed off:

-It's one thing to give a value-add video option for people who want it but don't tell me I can't videotape my own daughter after I spent over $200 for all the other supplies.

-And if you do tell me I can't videotape, don't screw me by charging $30 for it. That is crazy. I could buy a doubledisc Special Edition movie for $20, so why is a rinky dink operation like this charging me an arm and 2 legs?

-And if you do charge me $30 at least separate out each performance as a separate track and make a frigging menu screen instead of just a file naming screen.

-And if you don't take the time to at least give me something remotely like a professional disc, don't insult me by saying this is a professional recording and it is unlawful to make copies.

You know what? I'm making copies. I'm burning copies for every person in my family. I'm posting them on YouTube. I'm selling the master to some dude in China so he can sell them on the streets of Beijing for $5. I'm bit torrenting them. I'm sending them to public access TV, I'm sending it in to America's Funniest Home Videos. And most importantly, I am sending this article to Dateline NBC so someone can do something about this scam.

So Noodads, take this as a warning. If you see a restriction like "No videocameras", consider bringing a small camera and shooting yourself anyway.

 

Related Posts

Viewing 53 Comments

    • ^
    • v
    The video was 2:52. I estimate that your daughter was on camera for about 62 seconds.

    That\'s $.4838 per second.
    • ^
    • v
    As with many other services, you have to be aware of the \"hidden costs\" involved when choosing a dance studio. My wife runs a dance studio, and while her monthly rates are only slightly less than those of her competitors, I\'m always amazed at how much the other studios gouge when it comes to costumes, recital tickets, and other fees.
    As for the recital video, we don\'t allow parents to videotape the night of the performance as the auditorium is very crowded and raised camcorders would block the view of others. However, we do allow parents to videotape the night of the dress rehearsal. It\'s a clean run-through, so the only difference in a dress rehearsal video is there are fewer folks applauding at the conclusion of each number. Parents can even position themselves in front of the stage during their child\'s performance to make their videos and take pictures.
    We do not allow flash photography at the performance as it makes the experience more difficult for students who are nervous about performing. We do allow it at the dress rehearsal since there are fewer nerves that evening and we do want parents to be able to take pictures.
    Recital tickets are $2, and each family receives two at no cost. Programs are $3. I do the recital DVD, and it is $20 but includes the holiday recital video (with the chapter markers you mentioned), the dress rehearsal, and a picture slideshow.
    I don\'t know what dance studio choices are in your area, but I hope you can find one that provides a better value for your investment.
    • ^
    • v
    Our daughters\' dance studio charged $45 for the first video and $15 for each addtional...we couldn\'t believe the price when we read it...absolutely stunned. We would not go down that road because, as you found, our daughters would not be captured on film as we would like and the price was just ridiculous. Fortunately, we were allowed to video tape during the recitals, but I\'m thinking that this option may be taken away from us in the future. Incidentally, we couldn\'t believe the number of people who were obviously going to purchase the video due to the lack of video cameras in the audience...maybe 3 or 4, and this is a good size auditorium.
    • ^
    • v
    My daughter just had her first recital and, like you, I was going to be on the hook for lessons, CONCERT FEE :eek, tickets, costume, pictures, and concert video (no videotaping allowed). I got around the no video and pictures rule by videotaping and getting pictures at the dress rehersal. Now I have an excellent video of my daughter\'s recital without the $25 video charge. (Didn\'t pay for pictures either). :grin
    • ^
    • v
    I\'ll bet you anything that these \"video companies\" promise a cut of the take to the dance studio.
    • ^
    • v
    I am a dance studio owner.
    Just FYI.
    A) the video company charges me $3000 YES that\'s $3000 to video tape and copy the DVDs. (don\'t believe me? go through your phone book and call a few companies randomly and ask how much it is)I make ZERO from this video.
    Since I have a conscience and its my choice to have this professionally done, I allow the parents to video tape the dress rehearsal. No one wants some obnoxious guy jockeying for position to tape his kid while you are trying to enjoy the show....not to mention the geniuses to refuse to stay in their seat but have to go to the foot of the stage to video tape, completely distracting not only their own, but every OTHER 4 year old on the stage.....leaving them staring at Susie\'s Daddy who is waving and trying to get Susie\'s attention instead of remembering their dance.

    B) I can control who comes in and tapes at dress rehearsal . Anyone can buy a ticket for the show. That means anyone , if you had your way, would be able to video tape your little girl and plaster it all over You Tube. Where have you been? Don\'t you get that its a pedophiles dream to do what you are suggesting?

    C) If you think dance studio owners are getting rich doing what we are doing, think again. Yes we charge for recital tickets and costumes. Its called trying to pay 12 months of bills on 10 months of income. While your little one is off at summer camp for 2 months, I am sweating it out still trying to pay my rent, utilities, music licensing rights, insurance plus losing money on the pitiful summer courses trying to keep the teachers employed so they won\'t go out and get another job so your kid will have both a teacher and a school to come back to in the fall.

    Get the whole story before you go shooting off your mouth.


    :(
    • ^
    • v
    My 4 year old daughter takes ballet lessons. Cool right? And she totally gets into it.
    - Fantastic! This what you\'re job is - making her happy and finding what she excels in.

    So at the end of the year we get to go watch her perform with her class. This mind you, is a performance where every class from every age group in the entire dance studio performs.
    - Oh, so everyone else is piddledinks to your four year old standing there picking her nose, shuffling around. Got it. Screw the older kids with amazing training and their parents wanting to see them, it\'s all about your pants wetter.

    the professional pictures with her in costume
    - This is always optional, so take your own, Noodad. This is where you start stretching.

    or the tickets for that matter (although it is sort of a rip off because they know people aren\'t going to miss the performance no matter how much they charge).
    - I\'m sorry, how else do you expect them to pay for the auditorium? Get a clue, Noodad!

    You are not allowed to take pictures or video during the performance.
    - Okay, so you want EVERYONE to be standing, waving, blowing kisses, yelling for their kids\' attention to take video and photos. That would be utter chaos. You are so ignorant, Noodad. It\'s not all about your and your ankle biter.

    Her class was pretty big and the dance line stretched across the stage. So the entire performance had the camera panning back and forth. I basically saw my daughter 4 times in a 3 minute period.
    - That has nothing to do with the videographer. Blame the dance teacher for choreographing a dance this way. Anyone who thinks of the grand scheme of things will not line the kids up for this specific reason.

    The demands you make for a quality video is all in the price. You\'re going to have to pay more for a video if you want extra time spent. They work hard those four weeks getting out all of those dvds just do you can rip them apart. You want MGM quality, give them time and throw a couple more bucks into it. Yeah, you can buy a special edition doubledisc for less than $30 because they are mass produced. You are an idiot, Noodad!

    I\'m posting them on YouTube.
    - So you\'re cool with some nasty guy beatin\' off to your little girl? Good one, Noodad! This is also another reason to not allow everyone and ANYONE to tape your little girl. Grow a brain!

    If you see a restriction like \"No videocameras\", consider bringing a small camera and shooting yourself anyway.
    - Refer to the above comment.

    Noodad, you\'re a jerk and an idiot. I feel sorry for your little girl, espcially after she\'s been plaster on the net for the world to do with as they please. I think I just threw up a little in my mouth.
    • ^
    • v
    As stated above, you have no clue how much money it takes to put on a professional looking dance performance or to run a dance studio. I will not even acknowledge your ignorance by giving details.
    I just want you to know that most of us studio owners, who you think are making millions, do what we do for the love of dance and your children. Most of us do not drive new fancy cars or live in fancy houses. Most of us do not even take much of a paycheck, if any at all. Plus most of us work a full time job besides the full time job of running a dance studio so that we can survive. Get a life. Let us attempt to make a living and make your child happy. Why is it that the general public expects us to do a great job for their kids, but doesn\'t think we should make any money??????? By the way, I make absolutely nothing from the sale of videotapes of my shows.
    • ^
    • v
    You know I just love parents who think that I am rich and living in a mansion somewhere because they pay me $40 a month in tuition. Little do you know that I make nothing off of the videos I sell, nothing of off the pictures that the photographer takes, and nothing off of the recital ticket sales. Actually I am lucky if I am not in the hole by the thousands after the recital is over.

    I also just spent over $4,000 on my one and only \"vacation\" for the year, at a dance conference for teachers so that your little girl can benefit as much as possible from her dance classes.

    I can speak for your daughter\'s teacher and say that I am not doing any of this to make money and I am definetly not doing it for you! I am doing it for your little girl who has an idiot for a father in hopes that she will somehow manage to come out of it a better person.

    The above poster is right, get a clue before you go mouthing off about things when you really don\'t know what you are talking about.
    • ^
    • v
    I love your ignorance noodad.

    I pity your kids because you don\'t want to spend a couple bucks on a video tape to see them dance for 3 seconds. This may sound insane to you, but for those of us who have the parents who love us enough to buy these videos and not gripe about...we are still watching them years later!
    • ^
    • v
    \"Sometimes I speak before I think\" - Gregory Ng

    Darlin\' seems you\'ve already put your foot in a few piles driving your mouth without a clutch... :oD Now, I really should let you know that I hugely admire the intent of your blog - to support new dads. So, in an effort to help you avoid putting the other foot in any deeper than need be... I, most respectfully, suggest you do at least a bit of research before you write and insult an entire community of hard working, dedicated people - one in particular to whom you entrust your own child.

    Please consider this:
    Do you begrude the Gap when you buy your children sneakers to match the outfits you just picked out? The grocer when you purchase milk for your child\'s cereal? The college you graduated from for the books you were required to buy?

    A dance studio is an educational environment. It caters to children. It is also a business. And like the college bookstore, studio owners often provide supplies and support services to their clientelle in an effort to offer convenience and to help keep the business viable.

    You have choices all along the way. You can use the sneakers the kids already own with their new outfits, you can have your children eat dry cereal for breakfast, you could have gone to the library and borrowed the books or bought used ones in college. Of course the dry cereal bit may be going too far - but, some parents feel professional pictures of their child in their costumes are just as mandatory. Sincerely, I have some of these dance families I promise ;o}

    Your choices continue; to which studio you send your child, how much and what you purchase, and what kind of example you will set for your child in the process. By suggesting that one should openly ignore studio policy so that you can \"get yours\" isn\'t quite the lesson I imagine you would want your children to learn - and they are watching every move you make. Just see how they respond the next time they stub their toe if you don\'t believe me...

    Here are some facts:
    A studio needs to be educationally sound and financially stable in order to provide its students with a quality dance education. If the biz can\'t afford to stay open, everyone loses.

    The recital is a huge financial undertaking for every studio. Make no mistake, the studio takes a gamble every year - that ticket sales will cover the always increasing expenses. Do you have any idea how much it costs to put on a performance such as this? The expense list is far too long to list here, but I welcome you to contact me and I\'ll happily fill you in - money wise, it represents 10\'s of thousands.

    Most studios make no profit on photos or dvds. These services are subcontracted and it is common that the studio owner receives a copy for use in advertising but usually that\'s all. For those that do receive financial compensation, it is a very small percent.

    Other studio owners have already mentioned that first and foremost, \"no photo/video during performance\" policies are an audience management issue. Not a financial one. For years, prior to our using the services of pro photographers and videographers, we had this policy in place - it had nothing to do with making money and everything to do with insuring ALL audience members could enjoy seeing their kids onstage.

    We DO allow cameras during Dress Rehearsal and it is a madhouse. Parents thank me every year (after watching the mayhem at Dress) for not allowing cameras show nite.

    The cost of the photos/dvds are set by the contracted companies. We studio owners have nothing to do with it. Consider the hours it takes to edit, the labor involved shooting and managing sales and the small # of sales (vs. mass produced dvds that sell for less) and you may begin to understand why the dvds cost what they do. I assure you, it isn\'t to finance my suite at the Ritz.

    Look, kids activities can get expensive. Believe me we get it (most of us are parents too...). You must choose carefully, set limits and stick to your budget. Personally I take pictures of my kid in his costume myself - but that\'s me. As for the dvd all I hear from parent after parent is that their kids watched that video daily all summer and that they couldn\'t have paid for a better babysitter.

    Guess you get what you pay for ;o}

    And, finally, a tip...
    Most studio owners love to barter - with your background, I bet you could easily come up with something the studio could use to help keep your costs (and hers) down.

    Much success to you Noodad and remember, use the clutch!
    Beth Wheeler
    adancersdream.net
    • ^
    • v
    1) I used to allow my parents to video tape during the performance until one year 2 dads got into a fist fight over one blocking the others view. This resulted in an elderly woman caught in the middle being sent to the hospital and the show stopped. After that I realized that many people do not have enough respect or know how to behave at a performing arts venue. I stoppped allowing video taping all together.

    2) As stated above, when you video tape it distracts the students on the stage who have worked all year to show \"YOU\" what they have accomplished. I feel it is my responsibility to allow these students to perform in the most professional show I can afford for all their hard work throughout the year. Now...have you have been to the theatre? Do they allow you to bring a video camera into see a Broadway show or any other professional show....NO!!! I believe by not allowing my parents to video tape it also teaches proper theatre etiquette to my students and parents.

    3) Youtube...are you OK????? Where do you think pedophiles search for children. You do not seem to care whether your child is plastered all over the internet. I only sell videos to my parents so I can be sure no stranger gets a copy of these children...and NO, we don\'t make a dime on the DVD\'s. Flash photography.....do you know how many dancers have been injured doing a turn or spin when a flash went off in their eyes and they lost their balance and fell. No..of course not. You wrote before gaining all the information.

    4) As stated above, you do not have to purchase pictures from the professional photographer. Take them yourself. Although I have students who have been with me for years and they love to look back on their class pictures and remember all the girls in their class and the routines they did those years. You can not put a price on those memories.

    5) Recital tickets..do you know how much it costs to rent a theatre facility now a days. I rent a local high school. I pay $250 an hour for the rental alone. We have the hall for about 20 hours between the block rehearsal, dress rehearsal and show..yep, you didn\'t realize how much goes into putting on a show, did you? Now, let\'s add on the rental of a backdrop and scenery, lighting and sound techs (usually about $50 an hour, flowers and trophies for the students and teachers and the list goes on. Seems sad to me that you whine about paying money to see your daughter perform. you can never put a price on that. I bet you don\'t blink about buying a few six packs or going to Dunkin Donuts every day or whatever your \"pleasure\" is.

    6) Your daughter wasn\'t on the video enough..agree with the above...her teacher should have choreographed better where students moved into different formations. Also, I talk with my videographer beforehand and make sure he knows to get as many shots of the students up close as possible. He uses 3 cameras to do so.

    7) I hear parents tell me all the time that they do not want the entire show. they only want their childs\' routine. Well, guess what? Once they buy the DVD they come back to me and tll me that their child hasnt stopped watching the ENTIRE video and actually copies the steps from other classes....hmmmm...it seems the video is also a learning tool for aspiring dancers and makes them want to learn more. Can you find anything bad in that. I can\'t!!


    8) If you are expecting a movie quality DVD for 30-40 dollars, forget it. Call the companies themselves and see. Do you realize the work that goes into those DVDs. Mine lists the name of the routine, the students in each routine and a menu to find the dances you want.

    to end this already too long email.....let me say that I have had my studio for over 25 years. I work 6 days a week from September through June. I do 4 weeksof camp in the summer and night classes but most peole take the summer off or are away so I struggle to make ends meet every year. Did you ever think about the rent on a space large enough for a dance studio? It is not like we rent a 500 square foot store front. My rent, insurance (think about what insurnace would be for a dance studio where students are doing a physical activity..astronomical!!!).

    I do not live in a fancy house. I cannot just take off and go away on vacation whenever I want....only school vacations and the prices are sky high at that time. My studio is open from 3-10PM weekdays and all day Saturdays...yes, no weekend trips for me either!! In the mornings and early afternoons, I pay bills, choose music, pick out costumes, sew costumes, choreograph, clean my studio, prepare my class lessons, accounting and billing, order costumes....a nightmare and hours of work and again the list goes on!!!
    Why do I do this? I certainly do nt get paid for half of what I do. As a matter of fact, I once kept track of all the hours I worked at home, errands for the studio, and everything besides my teaching hours. Do you know what I make...under $5 an hour. But, I love children and dance and want to pass that love on to them as well as give them memories to last a lifetime. My students are like my own children. I have most of them from the time they are 3 until they graduate. They keep in touch with me afterwards and tell me often how the dance studio was their second home and they still are best friends with the students they danced with for all those years.

    SO....please do your homework before you bash studio owners again!!

    So Noodads, take this as a warning. If you see a restriction like \"No videocameras\", consider bringing a small camera and shooting yourself anyway.
    • ^
    • v
    I am also a studio owner and couldnt agree more with every other SO who already posted. So take her out of dance if you\'re so upset about it. No one forced you to sign her up for dance. And no one is forcing you to keep her in it. Since this is an OPTIONAL activity, dont bitch about it, just take her out if you\'re not happy. If she really enjoys dance, she will be the one to suffer, but whatever it sounds like you are an ignorant parent anyhow.
    • ^
    • v
    Welcome Dance.net readers! Your traffic to our site has earned me enough to buy next year\'s dance video. Woo hoo.

    Ok. Here\'s how it goes ladies.

    In almost each one of your cases, you mention allowing people to videotape the dress rehearsal. I\'m down with that. I just didn\'t have that option.

    So first off, chill.

    Secondly, I don\'t mind paying my monthly tuition to pay for your rent. I get it. You provide a service. I\'m totally into paying you to do it.

    But that still doesn\'t excuse the piss poor quality of the videographer (in my particular situation). If these guys took 4 weeks to perfect their DVD, they need a different profession.

    \"I\'ve seen better film on teeth.\"

    As for youTube, it is you, ignorant dance studio owner that is mistaken. There is such a thing as \"private\" videos on YouTube where only my family whom I give permission to can view them.

    Besides that, thanks for paying my bills. keep the comments coming!
    • ^
    • v
    Dance Class cost for you
    1. Tuition
    2.Costume
    3. Pictures
    4. Video
    5. Ticketrs

    All of the above is optional.

    It seems like you don\'t agree with the Video part because it is not something directly for you. Forget the fact that you child will want to watch the other classes that her friends are in ect.... We need to get back to what you are getting out it.

    Studio\'s rules about no video tapes are for the people like you who think that if you want it you should get it. For example: Why should you have to pay for a video, you should have the right to stand up in front of the parents of the girl beside your daughter who paid the same as you because you should be able to save a bit of cash for this silly little thing your daught would like to do. Why should you have to pay so the studio can\'t afford to offer vidieo\'s for the dad\'s in Iraq or away on business because who cares if it is also their special day.

    Why should you pay $30 for a momento for your daughter, man you have already forked out $150 for this experience why should you be asked for more. Because we all know that you are the dad who volunteered to help the dance teacher who loaded in 10 hours earlier all the sets, scenery,ect. To help your daughter have her special day. And to be slapped in the face with Ticket prices because doesn\'t the auditorium know that they should give this to you for free.

    Let\'s see that $30 could have bought you some beer, 1/3 of a game of golf, one spin through a fast food drive though. It didn\'t seem that you were too hard up for cash you just didn\'t see anything in for it for YOU.

    OH was this about you I thought this was about your daughter.
    • ^
    • v
    Noodad! We\'re under attack by a twisted dance teacher sorority! My eyes and ears. THEY BURN!!

    I am so glad my kid is not in ballet right now.

    In the words of Nelson Muntz: HA HA!
    • ^
    • v
    Hey this is like free therapy! No Dad in any of our schools would ever have the cajones to admit they are too cheap to buy the video (which in your case is what- half the price of a tank of gas?)so we get to take out all of our agression on you! :zzz
    In any case, have your studio owner post on dance.net and we will be happy to get a hold of a videographer who has a clue in the Norfolk area.
    • ^
    • v
    In the meantime, let us remember that when a flash goes off, the body naturally senses danger,tenses up, and gets sidetracked.

    Let\\\'s experiment on a bunch of nervous little dancers and see if their concentration is botched when they see the sudden flash or red blinking light. Nevermind, you already plan on doing it at your daughters next performance. Do let us know how it goes...

    The rules are in place for a reason. Not just for people to be snooty.
    • ^
    • v
    Yesterday I saw a car in front of me with a bumper sticker that said, \"Driver has no cash - son plays ice hockey.\"

    Why do I mention that? Because if you have any idea how much it costs to put a child in ice hockey, you would probably not be on here complaining. I guess if your daughter were in ice hockey, maybe you would not complain as much as I find fathers have a hard time with the cost of the arts for their kids but not the cost of sports.

    Here is what I say. If you knew these costs beforehand, you could have just said, \"no\" and not done it. I know for a fact that no dance studio makes anyone do anything. It\'s offered and you can take it or leave it.

    Running a show is quite expensive. I know that most dance schools break even or barely go over costs of productions so money you pay for the production helps cover the costs.

    If you buy a video, realize that all the other parents want to see their kids, too. If you don\'t want to see the other kids on your video, have her dance at home and tape it. Then it will be just her.

    I am sure all the other dancers who worked very hard are hoping that you took the time to watch and appreciate their work, knowing that if your child continues, that she may be that good, too.

    Let me give you a little reality check. Both my children danced. My daughter is a teacher and now a new mommy. My son danced until he was ten. We paid for videos, ticket and all that, and loved every moment.

    Three years ago a drunk driver took my son\'s life. All we have are pictures and videos. Watching him, even for a brief moment on video, is very special to us. The memories of his love of dancing and the joy it brought us is very precious.

    In the scheme of life, is it really worth causing such a stir? Instead, take the time to have joy in her love of dance, know that the dance school is a business and not trying to rip you off but rather trying to offer what all other schools offer, to be competitive and stay in business and hopefully make enough to buy food, pay for a roof over their heads, have a nice car and allow their own kids to have wonderful outside activities such as your daughter.

    Your daughter is very blessed to have a dad who will send her to dance school. The fathers at our dance school are the best. They volunteer when needed, support their kids love of dance and root their kids on, even when things are not perfect, because they know the kids are happy doing this.

    Isn\'t THAT what it\'s all about? It\'s really not about US, the parents, but about THEM the kids.

    Go home, kiss and cherish your child. Life is too short and sometimes too fleeting and those we love can be gone in an instant.

    I would give $30,OOO to see my son again.



    :sigh
    • ^
    • v
    You said:
    \"As for youTube, it is you, ignorant dance studio owner that is mistaken. There is such a thing as \"private\" videos on YouTube where only my family whom I give permission to can view them. \"

    So you can guarantee that EVERYONE who is permitted to video tape is going to do just that? Not one of those is going to be some sicko who collects video of little girls for his own viewing pleasure? When I sell the video I control who has it. That means I know I am selling it to parents of kids at my school. With a show that has open admission, video taping in this case takes that out of my hands.

    Just wanted to clarify.
    • ^
    • v
    Thanks for the education. Let me offer this bit of news so you understand I am really not out to get you guys!

    The issue for me is the money (For the DVD) versus what I received. NOT just the money. NOT just the fact that I couldn\'t videotape the dress rehearsal.

    If studios are breaking even for the performance, ask for donations! I would gladly pay that after seeing the enjoyment
    on my daughter\'s face every day after dance class.

    I have shown more restraint than I should have not calling out the DVD production company by name. I\'m still waiting for their response to my complaints.

    Stay tuned. I\'ll be sure to update everyone.
    • ^
    • v
    Do you guys make sure that everyone that attends these dress rehearsals (where you grant permission to videotape) are parents and not \"sickos\"?
    • ^
    • v
    We do our own videos and sell them for $25. I ask that parents don\'t video from the seats, but from the balcony area or behind the floor seating as not to distract others, I think this is very generous as most places do not allow this.
    That being said, our videos are not the best, we can not afford to hire a company to do them, they wanted $1000 just to be there and video not including the cost of the dvds which would be an additional $15 per dvd, so you see, if I only had 40-50 parents ordering dvds, I would be out money from the get go. Crazy.
    There is much more that goes into these things than one might think. Please consider all the possibilites before jumping to conclusions that you are getting a bum deal.
    I am sure the videos we buy at walmart only cost Walmart $1, yet we pay $19.99.
    Someone one is making good money, but I can guarantee you it is not most of the studio owners I know.
    • ^
    • v
    Each parent is issued a bracelet (like the paper kind you get at a theme park). No bracelet- no entry.

    And really Noodad...when you read your original post it comes off much more like its anti dance studio , not anti guy who the dance studio hired to tape my daughter\'s recital. \"Gang rape\" was the term you used, I believe.

    Seriously. I have a few e mails out and will have some recommendations for your school for next year for a videographer. In the meantime I am sure we will all feel better if you post an apology to all us hard working studio owners everywhere.

    Uncle?
    • ^
    • v
    \"Now I can on and on on how you have to not only pay for the classes but you need to pay for the costume, the fancy sweatshirt with the embroidered name on the sleeve, the professional pictures with her in costume, and even the tickets to the show but that may make you think this is all a scam.\"
    So if your son or daughter played sports and needed all the equipment you would think that was a scam?

    \"...so why is a rinky dink operation like this charging me an arm and 2 legs?\"
    So why are you sending your daughter to a dance class if you think dance education and the arts are rinky dink? Do you have any clue how beneficial arts education is to children?

    \"I\'m selling the master to some dude in China so he can sell them on the streets of Beijing for $5. I\'m bit torrenting them. I\'m sending them to public access TV, I\'m sending it in to America\'s Funniest Home Videos.\"
    I can\'t believe you would even think of sending a video of your daughter and innocent kids ... you are one sick dude!

    \"Well, here is where we get to the gang raping part\"
    Would you really want your daughter to hear you talk like this about the dance studio and teacher she most likely loves.

    I feel very sorry for your daughter.
    • ^
    • v
    Did you ever think that maybe your daughter would like to watch the entire show so that she can see what she has to look forward to if she continues to take lessons and work hard? Probably not since your head is so far up your butt. It\'s people like you who make a studio owner\'s life miserable.
    • ^
    • v
    Foodad pointed out earlier that Noodad paid almost 50 cents per second for his daughter\'s video.

    That puts your hourly rate at $1800! You folks must be living in mansions and eating caviar. No wonder you are so flippant with your customer. You can afford to be.
    • ^
    • v
    It cost me $6000 to get our video done. That is for just one show---yes--one show!
    • ^
    • v
    Clearly, the dance teacher/studio owner community is fired up about this post. Kudos to you for engaging in the kind of democratic free exchange of ideas that the internet enables... The point of a comment function on a web site exists precisely for this reason...so people of differing viewpoints can \"comment\" with alternative points of view. Unfortunately most of the above commenters seem to view tearing Noodad a new one as a cathartic opportunity (...perhaps a chance to vent years of frustration with misinformed parents) and are viewing the ability to share their opinion as a \"Lambaste\" function. Any mature adult, especially an educator of children, should recognize that people are most effectively convinced by rational arguments and clear presentation of points. Some of the points made above are thoughtful and logical...most are not. As a dad, I value the service that Noodad.com provides precisely because moms and females feel empowered to weigh in on issues presented here. I find it useful. I learn a lot. In this instance, I am, as a whole, disappointed in the members of the dance teacher/studio owner community that have chosen to reply to this post for being so decisive and unnecessarily combative. Perhaps the people you all seek to enlighten (and dads in particular who you should know with all of your years of experience might recoil and become closed off to hearing your POV from this kind of assault) might have been better served if the post on your site (dance.net) had been entitled \"Please help me educate this misinformed dad\" rather than \"Please help me tell this clueless guy off\"...missed opportunity dance teacher/studio owners. You focused your energy to crap on one dad when you could have been helping to educate many.
    • ^
    • v
    I am surpised by the attitude of most of the comments here. Here is an opportunity to educate a disgruntled customer (and the his hundreds of thousands of loyal, daily noodad readers), but instead you lambaste him like a bunch of anonymous, know-it-all, forumites.

    For shame! You are only casting your fellow dance recial businesswomyn, not to mention the American small business owner, into a dark light! We are the pathetic ones? What happened to \"the customer is always right?\"

    Aside from Redhawk, who is a friend of the site, who of you has attempted to make Noodad a believer without cursing him out and feeling sorry for his children.

    Dancer, please!

    Noodad is like \"best dad on server\". This is not some dead-beat, child support dodging, single father spending all of his 10 kids child support money on the horses. He is influential. He pays both the bills and attention to his kids. This is the kind of guy you want to convert to your side, not thrust deeper into the anus-of-hatred.

    If Noodad is feeling like this, chances are that many other noodads are feeling the same way. They aren\'t usually shy about telling us when we are off base.

    Looks like customer service is truly dead in America, or at least in the kiddie ballet industry.
    • ^
    • v
    There are responders in this thread who chose to list their name and to try to educate. Yup, I was and still am one of \'em. To this we got a \"thanks for clicking on the site and making me more money\".

    I still stand in the place that I admire that you guys are trying to educate and support new dads. I think this is wonderful. I would very much like to see you do it without attacking those who support your kids on a daily basis (and could very well have begun doing the same for you or your peers when you were still in diapers).

    I agree that some responders got caught up in the heat of the original post - it was extremely insulting - and replied in like fashion. Guys you truly reap what you sow.

    The point is, Gregory claims his position is simply that he felt the quality of the product was poor in contrast to the expense. However, in truth he loaded that by packing a whole lot of extranious insults directed at our industry. So, yup, y\'all got the response you planted.

    And, no, of course you wouldn\'t hear any of the studio owners who replied speak to a child in this manner - but I know many of the ladies who responded and, trust me, they\'d defend your kids with the same passion they\'re defending themselves.

    And, I must say, reading through more of your site, that the rough language and manner you seem now so offended by is nothing new - you guys lay it out all over the place.

    So, to offer you a bit of the education you have asked for I would suggest that if you don\'t like being addressed in this manner, you don\'t do it to others.

    You know the drill, treat others as you wish to be treated.

    Most respectfully,
    Beth Wheeler
    adancersdream.net
    • ^
    • v
    I don\\\'t allow parents to videotape dress rehearsals, I don\\\'t allow anyone. I have several reasons. I used to but a mom of a student\\\'s friend came and videotaped (supposedly for the kid) and 2 complete numbers were stolen and seen performed during the halftime show by the dance team of the next city\\\'s school! That\\\'s stealing.

    It is my responsibility to keep the kids safe so I go out of my way to make sure of this. There have been a few attempted \\\"takings\\\" of kids - a dad who didn\\\'t have custody, by a \\\"predator\\\", I know of a few and I know this has happened at other types of kids activities. Is it safe to allow everyone to videotape at random? No, it\\\'s not safe in many ways.

    No one should ever put a video on the internet of a kid without specific permission by the parent and whether you set your page to private it doesn\\\'t matter. You cannot control what someone whom you give permission to access the site, will do.

    I have seen an over zealous parent get in the way so bad videotaping and he even turned on a flash, that his kid fell off the stage!! She broke her leg. He went up to the front of the stage and followed her. Other parents were upset and rightfully so. The entire class who had worked so hard all year fell apart(and if you think about it it\\\'s more than a years work, you keep dancing year to year and what you see is a result of all training). I was mortified. I vowed never to get into that predicament if I had my own studio. I once sat behind a parent at a recital years ago and never got to see the person I came to see because all I could do was to look at that camera. It was on the entire show and it was a full house, no empty seats. Plus, you videotape the show, you miss the show! It\\\'s NOT the same. It\\\'s also rude audience behavior. You can\\\'t go and videotape \\\"The Lion King\\\" just because you paid for a ticket. There are also copyright laws and the music is protected and belongs to the composer and choreography belongs to the choreographer or the studio, depending on the arrangement.

    I\\\'ve seen parents get into fights, verbal and physical. They do it at sports games, too. Parents behave SO badly at times. They bring a huge board in with coolers to put on top so people won\\\'t sit in those seats. They \\\"save\\\" seats and then someone comes in an hour later or during the 2nd half for the seat and meanwhile a parent who was there on time to see their chld and who paid just as much for the dance education (it is EDUCATION) is upset. You want a good seat - get there on time.

    Just because you pay for lessons, etc. doesn\\\'t mean you shouldn\\\'t have to pay for the performance. Tickets pay for the performance, police - you have to pay their cost then pay into a special general retirement fund for cops so you are paying double, extra insurance you have to carry, technical staff, auditorium rental, equipment and backdrop rental (talk about thousands), lighting, etc. You can\'t ask for or get donations if you are not an officially designated non-profit organization!!

    So you know ASCAP doesn\\\'t allow the sale of videos for a profit. They also don\\\'t allow parents videotaping which they consider stealing of the music. They are very strict. Teachers/owners don\\\'t agree with a lot but they are obligated to follow their rules and there\\\'s more co.\\\'s than ASCAP now. We have to pay to use the music in class or performance. We\\\'re allowed to have only so many performances.

    Your use of the word \\\"gang rape\\\" especially when talking about a field that is primarily female and considering you\\\'re talking about your daughter, is something I find EXTREMELY offensive.

    Good thing your daughter doesn\\\'t skate...let\\\'s see...used skates $400 and of course they keep growing out of them. The costumes are easily $1000+ up. Ice time, etc. What about hockey? Even gymnastics.

    BE GLAD YOU HAVE A CHILD THAT HAS THESE INTERESTS AND THE ABILITY TO PERSUE THEM. She has a healthy body and mind and the support financially and physically from you...and you\\\'re complaing about $30. One of my students (started with me at age 14 and she\\\'s 29 now) just lost her child. I bet she\\\'d pay $30 in a heartbeat to see her kid over and over again. You are a good dad to support your chlid\\\'s interest. I have seen many over the years who don\\\'t get the opportunity your child has.

    However, you should be ashamed of your original post and the term \\\"gang rape\\\" over and over. You owe an apology. As for calling your studio owner\'s business a \'rinky dink operation\'...how insulting and arrogant. My \'rinky dink\' operation is my career and I guess I wasted all that time in college and gaining performance experience as well as spending money yearly on continuing education. Talk about snobbery.

    In the meantime, I just heard the auditorium I use is upping their prices yet again for my annual show. Since tuition is for classes and studio costs I guess it means I have to increase my ticket prices a bit so I don\\\'t pull the money out of my own family\\\'s survival.

    No, it\\\'s not going to a new car. My 1995 Chevy with no a/c and a door handle that is broken on the driver\\\'s side (not fun in the winter) but leaves me with no car payment to make because I can\\\'t afford one, will have to keep getting us where we have to go.

    You really should think this through and know the whole picture of things before spouting off and this is directed at you and anyone else who feels the same. Otherwise you appear ignorant. Got a gripe? Make a conference appt. and talk about with your studio owner.

    There are always options and you have the option to have her stop dancing. By the way, $30 is cheap. Most cost around $40ish and that quote comes right from the video company. What do I get? A copy for the studio. As for pictures, I didn\\\'t offer them and parents asked for them so I made it available. Buying is always an option. What do I get for offering it? Surely not a trip to Hawaii!! I get a copy of every photo taken for the studio. If there is a company out there who pays a percentage to the studio owner, trust me the owner deserves it and it\\\'s very small. The owner has to be there, pay for utilities, often pose the kids, deal with parents and any issues that may come up.

    When your child watches the tape she/he\\\'ll watch the entire show and feel a part of something special, which it is, vs. only watching their own dance. Dancers like to see the entire dance so they can see what it looks like, so you know. The close-ups get in the way. I have my videographer do a pan but otherwise have the entire dance filmed so entrances and exits, formations, etc. aren\\\'t missed.

    You are giving your child a wonderful gift, the gift of dance whose lessons will enhance and benefit her life forever.
    • ^
    • v
    Foodad - Noodad is a reactive penny pincher that doesn\'t understand safety or production costs. He shouldn\'t be allowed to buy videos if he is going to let random people in China buy it for $5. Ask yourself this question: What reason would anyone have to buy a dvd of a bunch of 4 - 14 year olds dancing in little costumes that they don\'t know? That\'s just not right. And you think this is just one big lambaste? How would you feel if someone came at you like this about a business you were running, saying you were \"raping\" them? And just one more thing...you might be paying, but you\'re not the customer...you\'re child is.
    Besides, if you\'re always right, why don\'t you teach your kid how to dance. Apparently you always know best.

    Noodad - This isn\'t a sports team, and the only reason you are using some of the vocabulary that you use (as mis-spelled as it is), is because you can. If it was your son and you were talking to his coach like this, he would beat you or kick your son off the team. Grow up and start respecting the women that devote themselves to educating your children. Would you ever talk to their school teachers like this? Do you think that all the fun-raising, field trips, etc. that you have to pay for are a sham? No, because it\'s for education. And yet you forget that you already pay the school systems via outrageous taxes anyway. Well, dance is education, too. And studies show that kids who are involved in the arts are more likely to be successful, so you aren\'t just paying for a dance class, you\'re paying for your kids life.

    You listed many reasons that you thought you got ripped off by paying $30 dollars for a disk: so direct it to the video production company. The studio may have put on the show, but the videographers are contracted. All those things you mentioned about the price, the set-up on the disk, and warnings of copyright infringement are not dictated by the studio, but by the contractors. Let your studio know you are displeased, and maybe they\'ll find someone else next time, but don\'t take it out on them. And just know that if it has everything that you want, you\'re likely to pay closer to $50 a disk. When I was in marching band, VHS copies of the competitions were $50...DVD\'s were $65. So yeah, you can go get your double disk for $20 at wal-mart, but which has the better value? What is going to bring a smile to your face and tears of joy everytime you watch it? Are you going to play clips from that double-disk at your daughters wedding because you were too cheap to buy one $30 dvd a year? News bro...it just get\'s more expensive as she gets older, so get used to it. Oh, and that broken nose that your daughter has? Thank your camera for that as the flash blinded her when you took that last snapshot...so go ahead and sneak that camera in.

    Sincerely,

    SO\'s Boyfriend
    • ^
    • v
    Beth,

    You have not offended me in the least. I am the co-founder of a site that tries to combine aspects of \"The Man Show\" and \"babycenter.com\". (I am perplexed that you do not seem to know the difference between the brake of an automobile and the clutch, but I understand what you are getting at.)

    My site is a forum for everyone to discuss what it means to be a dad and how to get through it without f$*#ing up too much.

    That said, our site does not profess to know it all. We do not have a slick motto like \"Making noodads into pro-dads one dad at a time\". Ours is \"We\'re here for ya man!\" And if one of us is tweaked about something, usually the other has had a similar experience and we take that to the site where we are often corrected, or in this case, slapped around by professionals who do not share our viewpoints.

    Thanks for participating in the site and please learn the difference between the pedal in the middle and the far left one before driving again.

    foodad
    • ^
    • v
    Hi Guys. What did i miss?

    Jeez. Guess you really hit a nerve this time, huh Noodad? Was i the only one that got the selling DVDs in China line to be sarcasm?

    P.S. When I showed my wife this thread she asked, \"When did Noodad turn into a chick website?\" ROFL
    • ^
    • v
    >>>And just one more thing...you might be paying, but you\'re not the customer...you\'re child is.


    Are you serious? My kid is the customer!?

    The customer is the person who made the decision and ultimately purchased a good or service. My daughter would not be the customer, she would be a consumer (in software terms a user). The customer is the person you need to satisfy in order to make certain that they repeat the business. The customer IS indeed the person who paid. You may want to butt-out of an area you clearly do not understand. Leave the business to your girlfriend.


    Also, do not get all high-and-mighty on spelling with us. Otherwise I shall have to give you a 30 minute dissertation on the difference between \"your\" and \"you\'re\", as well as the irony of you misspelling \"misspelled\".

    We type fast. We do not have fancy editors. We have day jobs. You still get the point.
    • ^
    • v
    I understand your gripes about the video, and you should take that up with the studio owner and the videographer.

    You are seriously ignorant about what it takes to run a dance studio. You can see you hit a nerve here. It is because people seem to take offense if we make a profit, because children are involved. It is a business, and yes, we need to make money. We shouldn\'t be ashamed to make money. I know very few studio owners who are raking in the dough. Most of us barely scrape by, despite what people think.

    You are getting such a strong reaction because this is a huge issue for us. We get defensive. (can you tell? :) ) but it\'s frustrating when people think our jobs are just fun and games, and we are all rich. It costs a fortune to put on a recital and we make very little, if any profit on the stupid video.

    You should talk to your Studio owner if you don\'t like the policies. Most uf us do allow people to video during dress rehearsal. Are you happy with all the other things? Isn\'t this kind of small and petty if you do? You say your daughter is happy, isn\'t that what matters?

    I realize that you probably just didn\'t know any better, so I am not furious with you. You just needed to be informed, because obviously you didn\'t have a clue. Most parents don\'t and it is the responsibility of the Studio owner to educate them. I have a FAQ notice about why we have to sell tickets, why no flash photography or videos. I\'m sure I have people who are still pissed off about it, but that\'s my policy, stated up front and center when they register.

    Just wanted to let you know why they all got so upset. It isn\'t just videos. Parents seem to get soooo mad if we make a profit on anything. It is a business.
    • ^
    • v
    Suzanne,

    Thanks for vigilantly protecting the children who have been entrusted to you.


    I do not think that our ignorana-moose pal, Noodad, questions the safety of his kid at his local studio.
    • ^
    • v
    Guilty as charged.I totally admit getting completely worked up after reading Noodads post in his blog and I rallied up the troops....name calling and the whole enchilada. So to be sure I practice as I preach, for using the phrase \"tell off\" instead of \"enlighten\" you have my sincerest apologies.
    But when I read:
    \"it is sort of a rip off \" and
    \"here is where we get to the gang raping part.\" it most definitely upset me and obviously every other studio owner who read it.
    I see your gripe about the quality of the video. But to be quite honest with you if your studio owner reads your post I have a strong suspicion that you will be asked to bring your daughter to another studio.

    You not only (and maybe rightfully so) attacked the videographer, but you really made the whole dance school experience sound like a big scam....like we are staying awake at night figuring how to squeeze every last penny out of the poor unsuspecting parents who walk through our doors.
    You know you sounded that way. You are obviously an intelligent guy.....so I KNOW you know you sounded that way.I have a compromise....how about we help you out with something really helpful to new Dads...like what to look for when choosing a dance studio for your child. Maybe then we can put this to rest.
    • ^
    • v
    Dear Foodad,
    While you sort out the metaphors, you may be happy to hear I\\\'ll be leaving you to your man show. I really have no desire to be a part of insult hurling or one upping. I was sincerely looking to offer your readers and the original poster insight into how our business works so that you might have a better appreciation for all of the effort we put in daily to keep costs down and quality up.

    Even though you expressed that you were \\\"surprised at the attitudes\\\" the dance teachers were sharing as you felt \\\"here is an opportunity to educate a disgruntled customer (and the his hundreds of thousands of loyal, daily noodad readers)\\\" you don\\\'t seem to be choosing to take the opportunity to use the information we have offered to educate yourself. Instead you continue to hurl insults.

    I\\\'m sad, and only wish I\\\'d had you in our studio when you were younger so that I could have had the opportunity to teach you grace of spirit - and perhaps a bit of respect.

    Good luck with that,
    Beth Wheeler
    www.adancersdream.net
    • ^
    • v
    Sue,

    Welcome to noodad.com, the place where we help dads fumble through fatherhood.

    I would like to take this opportunity to take you up on your offer. If you would like to put together an article that you think would be helpful for educating noodads like us on choosing a dance studio, we would publish it on the site, and then link to it from this article so as to present your point of view on this topic.

    BTW - the article you read above is a pretty typical conversation in noodad-ese. We dads start by simply expressing dissatisfaction, \'overreact\' to the problem, take examples to extremes and then joke absurdly or rudely about the topic. What can we say? We\'re men. Please help. :zzz You can find our email addresses on the about page of the site.

    At the end of the day, we succeeded in our aim of presenting a topic, getting feedback and giving perspective to our vast, worldwide noodad readership.

    We would love to have you participate.

    foodad
    • ^
    • v
    Beth,

    Joking and one-upsmanship aside, please see my previous response to Sue. I will be happy to post an article that educates noodads on the finer points of the business as well as how to select a studio.

    We would greatly appreciate it and maybe it can be a collaboration between you and your dance.net \"team\".


    Thanks for coming to noodad.com and thanks for your continued participation.

    foodad
    • ^
    • v
    Good on you foodad - there may be hope for you boys yet ;o}
    B.
    • ^
    • v
    If you hadn\'t pissed my girlfriend off I wouldn\'t be saying anything, but yes it is my place because I am a male and I completely understand what these women go through. Maybe you should try taking a walk in their shoes. 8)
    • ^
    • v
    OK Noodad, its a deal, but make sure whatever I e mail you gets run by your wife first, ok?
    • ^
    • v
    Yes everyone it is I the Judge. I have held back posting because .. Oh I ws busy teaching, working at my business . The place I make a profit at. Geesh!

    NOODAD, in my opinion you come off as a pompus ass who is a real cheap skate to boot. I feel as though you view our business as \"frivilous\" because we are mainly run by woman. I get that you don\'t like woman very much. Sorry, just what I sense from your posts.

    If in fact the problem you are having is with the video company, don\'t call it a scam, CALL THE COMPANY! Wow that was hard. Oh I guess that is your wife\'s job right? If you call them and complain engouh they may just refund your money and then you can give back your DVD, of course after you have made a copy already. But you won\'t call the Video company because alas it is most likely run by a man!

    I won\'t waste my time informing you of all of the time and lack of money that goes along with this job. My dear friends above me have done a good job of that. But I will tell you that as far as I am concerned your child would not be welcomed back to my school. The classes would be full FOR EVER. I do not need to have such ignorant people in my life and in my business. My mission is to involve children in a positive envirnment to learn passion for the art of dance . I would not accept your money if you were the last student on earth. Too bad for your daughter though. She looks like a cute kid and definately deserves a better parent than you.
    • ^
    • v
    [comment deleted by foodad.... moved to its own article]

    http://www.noodad.com/cms/instructions/afterbir...
    • ^
    • v
    \"I have a strong suspicion that you will be asked to bring your daughter to another studio\" and \"your child would not be welcomed back to my school\"!

    As far as I\'m concerned, all the anonymous \"owners\" who won\'t identify their own business or website while trash talking at noodad are hoping nobody figures out where they are so Google won\'t connect the dots for future clients.
    • ^
    • v
    First off....do you know there are night vision cameras that make light color costumes invivible !!!! Yes and I\'ve caught someone doing just that. Most companies are insured and in our case bonded. We not only provide the service but we care about kids too. I\'ve seen youtube videos....costume malfunctions, close ups on the wrong part of the body, making fun of kids that dance bad.....yea....put your kid on there.
    For our \"Video business\" we shoot close-ups as well as whole stage shots at the same time using split screens. Our business has grown every year. Yes there are a few \"dads\" that think they could shoot just as well with limited focus and a non steady shot....is that the memory you want. maybe you had a bad company but don\'t ruin it for the rest of us. Why do you think we do weddings, bar mitzvahs etc.......people want a professional job. And aren\'t we entitled to earn a living too ? Would you take your car to the mechanic and use his garage and tools. Would you take your food to a restaurant and cook it there ? Yes we give money to the dance school as a donation. These people work on very little money when you actually see their overhead. The work they do for your kids is amazing. Late arrivals, temper tantrums and bickering ( and that\'s just from the moms.) No ones forcing you to buy anything, but if you\'re too cheap to purchase a video don\'t bitch. A lot of people appreciate the work we do. And lastly it\'s a shame you had to wait so long ( sarcastically ) It takes time to edit, add titles, master, duplicate and deliver these DVD\'s and tapes. We do over 75 shows in June and deliver over 7,000 orders. Yes it does take time. Most video companies run a demo in the lobby ( we do ) showing the dance you just viewed. If you don\'t like it....don\'t buy it. Most studios let you tape the dress rehersal. Go to it and tape what you need, but don\'t comprimise what we do.
    • ^
    • v
    Thanks Provid. Your operation seems to be a way better product that the one my studio chose. Split screen action is a great solution which my video did not have. Also for the time to edit, add titles, master, and duplicate, the one I received had no titles, had no editing. It was one track, started at the beginning and stopped at the end.

    Had no chapter headers, had no home menu, just set to autoplay. And in my case, we were not allowed to tape the dress rehearsal. Any chance you can send me your info so i can pass it along to my studio owner? email me at supernoo@noodad.com
    • ^
    • v
    I work for a great video company. We do recitals and only recitals and dance. I write this as an informative response to hopefully shed a little light on the points touched upon in the initial article as well as the responses.

    1) Many dance studios work all year teaching children an art that they, themselves love. They put their hearts and very long hours into teaching and preparing for the show. It would be proposterous to expect them to cover all the costs of having your children perform for you (demonstrate what they have learned, gain confidence, stage presence,and of course know that you are proud of them, etc). The cost of the costumes, the theatre rental, the high insurance rates, scenery, backdrop, programs, staff and the list goes on. And yet people will complain about having to pay to see their own child, not realizing that the alternative is a non-relative spending all their hard-earned money so you can see your child. I just feel that deserves some attention. Now, after all that work and the bonds they form with these wonderful children, they would like a record of that as well as of their choreography and the show as a whole. They do their best to hire someone they feel will deliver that professionally.

    2) Many people who are hired to film a recital, do not understand the unique animal that it is. Shooting a dance performance is very different than shooting a wedding....and most of these videographers ARE wedding videographers! When the video is bad, not only do you suffer, but so do the studio directors.

    3) It is true that you can buy a DVD in the store of a hit movie and only pay $20. Here are some things to consider though, and this applies to the professional companies who specialize in dance and do provide an excellent recording of the performance. (I will explain how in point 4)
    First, you have the initial investment. Our company (everything is geared for specific needs of dance) has invested 50-60 thousand dollars to deliver top quality videotaping and editing and that is bare minimum if you truly want an excellent product. If you wanted to air it, add another 100-150 thousand in appropriate equipment. Next, you have the initial contacting and contracting of the studios, the paperwork, the prep. You have the loading time, the driving time and expense, the set-up and breakdown, and the 1, 2, sometimes 3 days actually there shooting, sometimes all day. You have the tape, batteries, order forms, pens, media, etc (all the things that have to be replaced each show). You then have the editing time (minimum 1 full day per show, more if you are typing 30 dances of credits, each with 1-50 names in them, titles over each dance and menus for every dance. The you have duplication, tape/DVD stock, labels, cases. There is delivery, by mail or in person, again with time, driving expense, etc. I still have not figured in wear-and-tear, as this equipment will one day break down or become out-dated and have to be replaced. Now $30 is a great price. We charge $40, but most companies charge $50 (professional or not). Figure an average of 200 dancers in an average show, an average size school. With a reputable video and trusted customers, you will sell approximately 30-50%. You can expect to spend, in time alone, an all-inclusive 2-3 weeks on any one school, from initial contact to delivery. So my question is...how much would you charge? Honestly...

    4)I have two parts to this point. The first is why parents are not allowed to tape anymore, reasons you may or may not be aware of. Beginning with the most trivial (for lack of a more respectful word), many studios have had problems with fights breaking out, because people will get very emotional when their children are involved. If parent \\\"A\\\" is blocking parent \\\"B\\\" with that camera, and parent \\\"A\\\" does not want to lose that prime real estate, parent \\\"B\\\" is not a happy parent. This is just one obvious example. There have been numerous outbreaks over the years. Secondly, it has proven annoying in more than one instance and the directors want everyone to be comfortable and enjoy the show. Third, many people do actually want at least one live glimpse at their child and do not want to view their 3 minutes of fame through a viewfinder or 3\\\" LCD screen. Now to the more serious reasons. Choreography: this does belong to the choreographer and it has been stolen by those not belonging to the studio. Pedofiles: There have been people taping recitals who did not have children in the show, nor did they know any children in the show. I\\\'m sure they beat you to the Japanese market. This is a serious crime that you would not want attached to your own child in any way, yet it happens all the time...scary, but true. It is in large part, the condition of the world we live in that has brought us to this point. And going out of your way to break the rules and encourage others to do the same, is never the answer. That can only make it worse. Privacy: many videos have ended up on YouTube, making fun of a child who does not deserve that horribly impactful prank. Feasibility: there are companies who deliver a very professional job, that even the biggest Spielberg-Dad would be happy with. They do incur a massive amount of costs as evidenced in the earlier breakdown. People videotaping lowers sales, which does not allow us to continue to provide the same product. In fact, if everyone ordered a DVD, in most cases we actually lower our price. If you can get us a million sales (as in the store-bought DVD example you mentioned), I will personally videotape your child\\\'s studio and sell you a DVD for 25 cents. A million makes a big difference.
    The second part of my point is the fact that any company who realizes the needs of dance, can provide a professional DVD. We offer a video that allows you to see you child (and clearly) for the entire time they are on stage, as well as the option for you to see their close-ups also. We do have an animated icon for each individual dance. We have a themed intro, titles, etc. We give you a DVD, as themed, packaged, recollection of that child\\\'s year in dance...and it will last their lifetime.

    5) To the studios who pay $3000, or $6000 for their shows to be taped...you do not need to. There are companies who will make their money by making the video available to the parents and also provide you with complimentary copies for your studio. To the studios who wait 3 or more months to receive your videos, you do not have to. These things do take time, but not that much time. Delivery should be expected in 2-10 weeks, many factors determining which (number of shows you put on, how much special editing you want, titles, credits, etc). To all the studios receiving sub-standard videos, you do not have to. While there are things that are out of the videographer\\\'s control (your lighting, ambient audio, choreography and positioning of the children, available position for the camera equipment, etc) you can usually tell what is unavoidable and what is not. You can receive a professional recording of your performance.

    6) As a main concern I noticed was your response to the price of $30. If after the breakdown above, you still somehow feel the price is inflated, think about anything else you buy. Find out what it actually cost to make the shirt you are wearing. Or the car you drive. Or to build the house you live in. While there are many costs involved, the people selling you these products have invested a certain amount of time and a certain degree of skill and are entitled to a profit. If they only covered their costs, they would be producing those videos from a cardboard box. I\\\'m sure you can find additional examples even in your own line of work.

    7) Lastly, the people videotaping recitals....or anything or job for that matter...should care. Because it shows. It makes more difference than skill, or talent, or equipment. Some companies work for the money...and that is all they will ever make. Some people actually work because they love what they do and the reasons they do it for...and they make memories, they make valued long-standing clients and friends, and they sometimes even make a difference. We get compliments all the time, not to be immodest. It is the best reward to know that someone loved the video and to know that one day they will have that to look back on, as I do of my own recital or even home movies. They are priceless and the first thing people try to save from a fire after family and pets.
    I am sorry you have had such bad experiences, but please understand it is not always the case and when you find the right company, it is beneficial for eveyone involved and hardly \\\"gang-rape.\\\" I would never hold an occupation that could be classified, on any level, as such. I sincerely hope your studio finds a company you will all be happy with.
    Best of luck and I hope this has helped create a more level view.
    • ^
    • v
    To Noodad, I\'d be happy to, I am located in Central New Jersey. If you are in N.Y., N.Y. , Eastern, PA. or N.J. I will do just that. Let me know where you are and if it\'s feasible too
    • ^
    • v
    Erm... didn\\\'t read all of this, too long. But I noticed that a lot of people are bringing up the fact that if you post a vid of a child on YouTube, \\\"some sicko\\\" or even \\\"sicko\\\'s\\\" will be jacking off to it somewhere.

    Why is this a problem? I don\\\'t say that it\\\'s not disgusting. I don\\\'t say those people don\\\'t need help. But there are many, many vids of kids on YouTube, and most of them are a joy to see. I don\\\'t see why the thought that some pervert is watching the vids should interrupt my innocent pleasure at seeing vids of kids, or stop parents from posting vids of their kids.

    (I do, however, agree that each parent should be allowed to control the videos of their own children, so don\\\'t go posting vids of other parents\\\' kids.)

    I could MAYBE see that there is some danger of having a perv target a particular child in part due to or through the use of YouTube vids. But I don\\\'t think the risk of that is much greater than the risk of some perv grabbing them on a whim. If you take appropriate precautions with your children, the risk of both is pretty low. Furthermore, ideally it would be difficult for someone to connect a YouTube vid with the pinpointed location of an actual child; parents should take some precautions to avoid letting personal info slip, especially that of location. So don\\\'t put up vids of your kids with notes about \\\"This was in XYZ Dance Academy in Myton, Nebraska last Saturday\\\" etc.

    But as far as that mysterious guy out there who\\\'s getting off on the vids of my kids? Even if I had kids and had posted their vids on YouTube, the possibility - even the likelihood - wouldn\\\'t bother me.
 

Trackbacks

(Trackback URL)

close Reblog this comment
Powered by Disqus · Learn more
blog comments powered by Disqus